Ultimate Kiteboarding Support Boat
Thu, 09/01/2011 - 07:57
I am looking to buy a boat to support my kiting habit. What types of things would you look for in a boat?
So far, I am thinking 18 - 20 ft outboard drive boat. Big enough to deal with the swells and chop that come up with good kiting winds but still light enough to pull up / push off a sand bar. Also, its no fun to kite alone so a 6 to 8 person capacity is important.
Thoughts on hull design; skiff vs. deep V, hybrid?
4 stroke / 2 stroke?
center console, bowrider, walk around? Leaning toward CC as it offers the most accessible deck space but the ability to keep kites and passengers dry might be more important.
Thoughts on electronics and navigational aids also helpful. Thinking VHF with DSC, GPS with sat weather and a compass would be a nice set up.
Thanks
Thu, 09/01/2011 - 08:30
#1
- 2 stroke Evinrude E-TEC (if
- 2 stroke Evinrude E-TEC (if getting new)
- Center console
6-8 people is allot even without kite gear on a 18ft (I have a 1987 Boston Whaler Outrage)
- GPS basic (garmin 400-500 series)
- Radio (handheld but quality)
- Stereo system for sure
- Gear wont remain dry just too damn much of it and people
I love my 18' whaler.. Caution on the 17' because rides like shit in seas. They also have a 22 outrage thats a big boat but its sick. Look at older models not new 1987-2000
Thu, 09/01/2011 - 11:19
#3
kite support boat
I'm having similar thoughts, but also want a fishing boat, so probably looking at Mako or Grady, maybe an Andros
You might want to add a jack plate for shallow water access and remember board racks.
Don't forget radar to deal with lo-viz when returning.
A hole in the water into which you pour money...
Thu, 09/01/2011 - 11:46
#4
Michael;
Are you thinking of
Michael;
Are you thinking of a 26 ft custom Andros? That would definitely be sweet. Not a big market in those and new you would definitely have to drop some serious coin.
The marina I will keep the boat at is limited at right around 20 ft.
I agree the Radar would be nice, it would be hard to mount it high enough on a small boat to not be painting the crew with it. My plan is certainly to be out in VFR conditions only but there is always the chance I could end up flying blind.
Thu, 09/01/2011 - 11:44
#5
Funny timing! Was just at a
Funny timing! Was just at a boat dealer on Tuesday. Looking for essentially the same thing, with the additional ability to be a good family/wakeboarding/tubing boat. I've always been more drawn to the bowrider/dual console type boat, but my original instructor, Ty Luckett at KiteHatteras -- who's awesome btw -- had a cc boat which seemed like it'd serve well on all fronts. I believe his is/was Carolina Skiff. Any thoughts on these?
Thu, 09/01/2011 - 11:50
#6
Ty used to have a Carolina
Ty used to have a Carolina skiff. Now has an Andros. Its a bad ass ride! Phil at Kitesite has a Carolina skiff that he has set up for kite support and lessons.
Thu, 09/01/2011 - 12:26
#7
Can call me to discuss but
Can call me to discuss but for both reasons.. Save bunch of coin on older whalers.. All go very shallow and easy to push off as needed. 2stroke more power the etec is a great new engine better than a 4 i think. Sips gas and better torque curve. If looking used market will find 4strokes and old 2 and then really comes into year and hours on engine and make. As far as radar.. No need at all! Slow driving.. Lights on.. Horn in hand and GPS and a chart and compass. I mean how far you really going?
Skiff is nice if you are looking to break your back.. Works in Carolina's and Hatteras for one reason. Sound side and shallow water.
My boss just bought a 24' regulator single 250 with 130 hours for 55k for his first boat. Sick sick boat and will allow you to go out in anything but draws fair amount of water.. All about tradeoffs
Thu, 09/01/2011 - 15:41
#8
Thanks for the info! Sounds
Thanks for the info! Sounds like you definitely know your boats. Why do you say the Skiffs are so rough on your back? Flatter (or less deep) V? Assuming then that Whalers have deeper V. If that's true, how are they able to get into shallow waters? Still a pretty new kiter, even more of a boat noob! Thanks again for info!
Thu, 09/01/2011 - 16:10
#9
Kevin exactly. The 17'
Kevin exactly. The 17' Montauk (BW) is similar to a skiff. Very flat hull hence when said steer away if looking for ocean. Also bow riders same thing not typically good for ocean but great for lakes. If you look at the outrage line of Boston whaler (BW) they are not deep V like the regulators or Makos but are not flat either. The older ones tend to be better and are true to what Boston whalers are and have better interior space I think. They are work boats.. Cops, harbor patrol, military, FD's etc. Easy to ramp they never sink. Also when beach it pretty easy to just push it right back off if needed. Not great for bottom paint but can easily add more.
Thu, 09/01/2011 - 13:18
#10
Kite Boat
You might also want to look into a boat with a jet drive that will allow you to pull up to sandbars without banging up your prop, and generally allowing you to access shallow areas. Sea Doo has a bunch of bowriders with plenty of storage/seating capacity and board racks.
Thu, 09/01/2011 - 14:11
#11
Oceans though not so hot..
Oceans though not so hot.. Can always raise engine up when gets shallow just make sure have polarized glasses.
Thu, 09/01/2011 - 17:20
#12
You're gonna need a bigger
You're gonna need a bigger boat...
Thu, 09/01/2011 - 19:17
#13
My answer
I had the same thought about 1 year ago and spent the last year researching and looking at boats...
I bought a used 19' CC Boston Whaler Outrage 2006 with a 4 stroke 150 Merc on it. The boat drafts 1 foot, is easily handled by 1 person. It is the best thing I have ever done!!! Rated for 8 persons max. Very open layout. Heavier hull and modified Vs. Do realize many of the small whalers are skiff model hulls and you will get hammered in any rough chop and will not be able to cut through the waves like a V model. This boat has good storage and lots of nice room for gear. I haven't set up a great system for boards but I am thinking about something so we will see. I have a GPS/Sounds and VHF w/ DSC. You don't really need a radar cause if it's that foggy there isn't much to do out there anyway and you just proceed with caution.
The BW outrage 19 was sold as the Nantucket 19' for several years, there are lots of them out there for sale used and it is definitely a buyers market.
Boston Whalers are pricey and the new ones are insanely expensive but they used market is more reasonable. They are incredibly well built. There is a reason that the only brand of boat you see on the water over 20 years old is a whaler, seriously go look there are no other brands that stay together, the rest of them delaminate or get a hole in them somehow. I also own a 1979 whaler sport hull which is still in tremendous shape and has outlived 3 engines.
I wanted to a boat to be used in the shallow salt pond in RI where i live but something seaworthy enough to go to Block Is on the average day and even do trips to Montauk and Maybe Cuttyhunk/Vineyward/Nantucket. So far I've been out to Block Is 4 times, 12 miles one-way and had no trouble.
Feel free to pm or ask me any questions.
Thu, 09/01/2011 - 19:17
#14
My answer
I had the same thought about 1 year ago and spent the last year researching and looking at boats...
I bought a used 19' CC Boston Whaler Outrage 2006 with a 4 stroke 150 Merc on it. The boat drafts 1 foot, is easily handled by 1 person. It is the best thing I have ever done!!! Rated for 8 persons max. Very open layout. Heavier hull and modified Vs. Do realize many of the small whalers are skiff model hulls and you will get hammered in any rough chop and will not be able to cut through the waves like a V model. This boat has good storage and lots of nice room for gear. I haven't set up a great system for boards but I am thinking about something so we will see. I have a GPS/Sounds and VHF w/ DSC. You don't really need a radar cause if it's that foggy there isn't much to do out there anyway and you just proceed with caution.
The BW outrage 19 was sold as the Nantucket 19' for several years, there are lots of them out there for sale used and it is definitely a buyers market.
Boston Whalers are pricey and the new ones are insanely expensive but they used market is more reasonable. They are incredibly well built. There is a reason that the only brand of boat you see on the water over 20 years old is a whaler, seriously go look there are no other brands that stay together, the rest of them delaminate or get a hole in them somehow. I also own a 1979 whaler sport hull which is still in tremendous shape and has outlived 3 engines.
I wanted to a boat to be used in the shallow salt pond in RI where i live but something seaworthy enough to go to Block Is on the average day and even do trips to Montauk and Maybe Cuttyhunk/Vineyward/Nantucket. So far I've been out to Block Is 4 times, 12 miles one-way and had no trouble.
Feel free to pm or ask me any questions.
Thu, 09/01/2011 - 19:27
#15
Sailfish 236
I have a Sailfish 236 Yamaha 225f 2005 w/trailer, low hrs, loaded with good ele tronics, still covered and winterized from last winter. $30k
Fri, 09/02/2011 - 07:50
#16
It's a steal!
I have been on this boat, 30K is a steal!
Thu, 09/01/2011 - 21:48
#17
I have a CC Aquasport. I use
I have a CC Aquasport. I use it primarily for fishing but will be trying it out for kiting this weekend in Boston harbor. If I had an opportunity to get a different boat, I would now consider getting a 23' Parker sport cabin. These boats have a ton of deck space, secure, dry storage in the bunk and an enclosed cabin that can be heated. This I find to be key when in the water during the fall and spring. The heated, dry cabin extends your boating season two-fold. I love the CC but it has many limitations especially in foul weather or high winds, conditions that usually make for good kiting in New England.
Thu, 09/01/2011 - 23:29
#18
Thanks for all the good info!
Thanks for all the good info! Hope it doesn't take a year to find a boat...
Mon, 09/05/2011 - 21:50
#19
I bought my Carolina Skiff
I bought my Carolina Skiff from Ty Luckett back in 03 (I think) He now has a custom andros which is a sick boat for offshore and in shallow.
Had 8 People on it today with s- loads of gear and she handled it no problem.
The boat it set up specifically for Shallow water and kiteboarding.
Console is small and set very far back to keep as much space as possible.
21' DLX
90 Suzuki 4 Stroke (I will always own a suzuki) Zero problems, lot of use
Jack Plate- I can run slow in about 10 inches.
Garmin GPS $4-500 model- Works great.
Pros- Tons of room, You can beat the hell out of it, Low cost, easy to modify and set up how you want it. Runs in a drop of water, Will not sink.
Low Maintanence, Pivot turns.
Cons- Rough ride in chop, Driver doesnt notice, but passengers get air time!
Doesnt turn as much as it slides.
Best boat I have ever owned-
Mon, 09/05/2011 - 21:55
#20
http://www.facebook.com/#!/ph
http://www.facebook.com/#!/photo.php?fbid=10150234265540866&set=pu.245490835865&type=1&theater
Or search facebook for kitesite.net
Tue, 09/06/2011 - 07:51
#21
Thanks
Phil;
I did check out your rig. I agree it is the ultimate kite ferry, especially if your main trip is out to the southway / monomoy.
Tue, 09/06/2011 - 09:30
#22
Boat options
Have you considered a yamaha jet boat? If you want a boat to going fishing by a Center Console. If your wanting a boat to just kitesurf, wakeboard, and to chill on the water the Jet boats rule. Very shallow draft, easily managed by one person both on the water and the ramp. I've had a Lx2000 since new 2002 and I've managed every reapir myself. The Jet Drives are super easy to work on and the hull has taken some serious abuse without a problem. After ten years my engines still crank out 7,000 rpms and the boat tops out at well over 45mph. In my opinion two engines are a must if you want to get back every time. My Lx2000 seats 7 and has 270 HP, twin engine two-stroke 1300's Goes like stink. The new ones have more freeboard (for a drier ride) and twin four stroke engines -probably be drier ride but at only twenty feet your gonna get wet no matter what. get something fun and easy. Best part of the Jet boat is the internal propellers and theres no chance of hurting somebody. Another Inherent feature with Jet boats is that the engines and drives are located beneath the boat. This frees up the Stern from outboards etc. Most have a comfy large bed mat type cover over the engine bay and access in and out is great. After 10 years I still think it was a great call for going kiting, wakeboarding or just to enjoy a sunny day.
Tue, 09/06/2011 - 13:27
#23
Phil from Kitesite has a
Phil from Kitesite has a Carolina skiff with tower. They are good for getting in shallows but not great with the chop for flyimg around. But he can tell you best.
Wed, 09/07/2011 - 17:09
#24
echo!
echo! (echo!)
Tue, 09/06/2011 - 21:17
#25
kiteboat
[img_assist|nid=7397|title=skyhigh kiteboat|desc=Ribcraft 5.85 / Yamaha 150 4stroke|link=none|align=left|width=600|height=447]
Wed, 09/07/2011 - 16:22
#26
Very nice!
With a 150 that boat must really haul ass.
Fri, 09/16/2011 - 09:16
#27
Probably a naive question --
Probably a naive question -- but here goes: Is there such a thing as an offshore worthy bowrider? Having spent many summers as a kid waterskiing out of a bowrider, the bowrider layout feels like it'd be more family friendly. With 3 kids and wife, the family-friendly aspect is high on my personal priority list for a boat. The CC layout seems more fishing friendly, but the ADD/ADHD that my son and I both seem to suffer from makes us terrible (and grouchy) fisherman, so I don't see us needing a boat to be excessively fishing-capable. Any thoughts? Thanks!
Fri, 09/16/2011 - 10:16
#28
No
Sorry for simple reply but
No
Sorry for simple reply but really though think about the waves. Bow riders work in lakes because lack of swell and waves. Bow riders do not handle chop well and slam the people up forward, even center consoles can do the same and have known people to break pelvis bones if not careful while sitting too far forward. There are cuddy cabins but that's not where you would want to be while on the ocean. Hence the seating at the rear of the boat. Best is to stand and absorb chop with legs.
Fri, 09/16/2011 - 10:21
#29
Makes sense. Thanks!
Makes sense. Thanks!
Fri, 09/16/2011 - 17:16
#30
I grew up in a boating
I grew up in a boating family. We had a few boats over the years but the best family boat was a 20' deep V Wellcraft. Very seaworthy! We used it all the time to go to Block Island from Ninigret. We also used it in the back pond thru the tiny channels and around the sand bars. We knew exactly where we could take at what tide.
I think having some covered bow space/windsheild makes a boat much more versatile. Great for stinky weather, big seas, some place to get warm, get out of rain, spray, throw gear, could even sleep in the bow.
Sat, 09/17/2011 - 14:41
#31
Bowriders are not what you want
GO TO THE NEWPORT BOAT SHOW THIS WEEKEND SEPT 17-18. I was there on Thursday and while much of the show is larger 30/40/50 sailboats and power boats there is an ample selection of smaller size CC and cuddy cabins.
You can see 15 different brands and lots of models. Also all of the dealers have used inventory and often do consignments. I have never bought a boat at a show but supposedly on the ending day of the shows is the best deals as the dealers have committed to sell x number of boats and whatever they don't sell they have to take into their own inventory which is costly especially going into the winter months.
PURCHASING USED: You will need to have the engine inspected and compression tested on any used engine. Also the newer engines have computers and your best bet is to take it to an authorized dealer and have them look at the log. The engine log will tell you everything, i.e. every minute run at what RPM, all error codes, any major part replacements, maintenance logs, problems, alarms etc. It is nice when you are looking at getting the engine but it makes them basically unserviceable except by the authorized dealer. also I would never buy a used boat without a thorough sea trial. I bought my boat used this year from a dealer with a warranty and I still needed 3 sea trials until they get everything in working order. There are tons and tons of boats for sale and you can be choosy.
There is a very good and comprehensive used boat inspection guide on the boston whaler enthusiast web site "Continuous Wave" http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/buying.html. It is geared towards classic whalers but has much applicability. i.e. now is the best time to buy since a seller can avoid winterization and storage costs.
BOW RIDERS: As previously mentioned bow riders are mostly lake boats and not seaworthy per se if you have even the slighest intention of taking this boat into the ocean think otherwise.
CUDDY CABINS: are essentially useless, they just become places to store stuff and take up room, really a waste of space in my mind. If the weather is nasty you probably won't be out and no one will want to be in the cabin especially on a small boat cause it get's really nasty in there. The cuddy cabin on a boat smaller than 25 feet are super tiny to boot. They become worthwhile if you are adventurous and plan to spend the night on the boat but on a small trailerable boat they are very small and cramped.
4 STROKE VS. 2 STROKE: Generally the 4 strokes are quiter and now more reliable but since they are newer are generally more expensive. If you are buying an older boat with a motor great than 8-10 yrs old you kind of need to be ready for the motor to need replacing, it may not it may run for another 15 years but you just need to factor that into your offer and generally people say with older used boats you are buying the hull itself and the motor is a freebie.
ELECTRONICS: if the boat doesn't have em you can always add them. GPS w/ charts is very nice and VHF is required and almost every new VHF has DSC with GPS integration. Radars are often not need and unless you have a hard T top there is nowhere to mount it.
By the way unless I missed it I didn't see you mention where you planned to be doing most of your boating?
*******************************
I feel like a broken record here...but
Take a look at used Boston Whaler Nantucket and Outrage 19' footers. Yes they are expensive but there is a reason. If you find any boat over 20 years old on the water in good shape 9 out of 10 times it is a whaler. Truly nothing lasts like the whalers and they hold their value. Granted the prices for these boats new is out of sight and they are marketing to a different crowd from before, everyone of their promo shots has someone drinking a glass of wine. I also own a 1979 13ft whaler and my neighbor has a 1962 whaler in excellent shape. They have a nice bow area that you can get a large cushion for and also buy a little canvas dome for that turns it into a dry area. There is also a bimini top which can cover the console area for the extra sunny days.
Also I am now totally sold on leaning posts, note the photos below there are no chairs at the helm. Console seats, i.e. the chairs at the helm, are horrible except in completely flat water. When there is chop you are gonna be standing and the leaning post makes for an very comfortable ride, plus when you are at idle puttering around you can sit atop the leaning post.
I bought this boat this past June and I keep this boat on one of the coastal ponds in S. RI and take it out to Block Is. on a regular basis. It has been amazing!!!
It is a 2006 Boston Whaler Outrage 19' foot with a mercury 150 hp with the fishing package. This boat is basically ready to do anything fishing, clamming, beach hanging with the family, water skiing, kite missions to Block Is and it is light enough to trailer with an old jeep cherokee and push on and off sandbars by myself. There is ample and well designed storage. Missing frmo the photos there is an additional seat just forward of the console which is a cooler with a cushion. as well there are two stern quarter seats with cushions.
Here is my girl...
[img_assist|nid=7457|title=Boston Whaler Outrage 19' 2006|desc=|link=none|align=left|width=640|height=480]
[img_assist|nid=7460|title=BW Outrage 19'|desc=|link=none|align=left|width=640|height=480]
***********************************
Sat, 09/17/2011 - 18:15
#32
"CUDDY CABINS: are
"CUDDY CABINS: are essentially useless" I guess people have strong feelings about boat design just like kite preference. I'm not a fan of center console, my personal preference.
I want a protective windsheild area with seats, cuddy cabin, and preferably a canvas top over drivers area that can be put up in bad weather extending the cabin space. The drivers seat is not a waste. they're usually designed so you can stand or sit. Best to have the option to do both to reduce fatigue, depending on conditons. The cuddy cabin is not a waste. You can go under, or stand on top (not at speed). It gives you 2 levels. And it gives you the large windshield space which protects from spray. If you need to carry lots of people then center console offers more room while under way. But for a family of 4, cuddy cabins have plenty of room while cruising and are more versatile.
It all depends on how you plan on using the boat. If you're mostly going in fair weather and flat water, center console is probably fine, just not my preference. My family was, and is, really into seaworthy boats, tuna fishing offshore, family trips in bays and ocean, scuba, a brother that was a professional fisherman, another brother with his 22' boat docked behind his house, etc. So I know the benefits of the cuddy cabin design. It may not be necessary for your use but you should at least be informed.
My boat, however, is a 10' inflatable with 8 hp motor. I'm the black sheep of my family.
Sat, 09/17/2011 - 19:28
#33
Nice
Very nice!
Tue, 09/20/2011 - 09:32
#34
Parker deep V
I am thinking pretty seriously about buying 21 ft Parker CC with a deep V hull and 200 hp Yamaha 4 stroke. Its a compromise with a heavy weighting toward being more sea worthy and capable of supporting other on the water activities beyond the ultimate kite boat.
Sat, 09/24/2011 - 09:06
#35
I know I have had bad things
I know I have had bad things to say about cuddy cabins and I mostly stick by that if your game is to do mostly coastal/inshore activities, which was your original idea.
However, the sport cabins from Parker are not really a cuddy cabin. They are awesome boats essentially modified from commercial vessels. The layout on these boats is a way more intelligent use of space than a typical cc as there is much more open stern deck space as the pilothouse is generally more forward leaving lots of room for an nice open deck. As well many of their models have the outboard installed on a stern platform giving you even more use of the open deck space. While I have personally never rode on a parker before I have always admired them and it would certainly be on my shopping list if I was doing more offshore activities.
New or used?
Sat, 09/24/2011 - 09:34
#36
Sailfish
You should check out my Sailfish 23 CC if your thinking Parker CC's
Sun, 09/25/2011 - 20:01
#37
Too big
I have a hard limit at 20' 6" for hull length and 8' 6" for beam. Unfortunately, that rules out the Parker I was interested in as well.
I am still looking.
Wed, 12/28/2011 - 15:56
#38
2005 GW 209 Escape
I Bought a 2005 20' 6" Grady White center console with the 4 cylinder 150 hp Yamaha 4 stroke.
Wed, 12/28/2011 - 19:17
#39
very nice
oldcolonial wrote:
I Bought a 2005 20' 6" Grady White center console with the 4 cylinder 150 hp Yamaha 4 stroke.
Very nice choice! Can't beat a Grady and the 4 strokes are not only sweet, they will be better for resale.
Thu, 12/29/2011 - 20:47
#40
Congrats
How about a few photos...perhaps she is already wrapped up for the year.
Anyhow I was at least right about one thing...it would take a while to find the right boat.
Fri, 12/30/2011 - 18:33
#41
O.K. I've got boat envy.
O.K. I've got boat envy. Congrats on the new acquisition! You're gonna have some adventures in that baby.
Sam;
Thanks for the info. Would you stay away from the newer ones to save coin or are they just not as nice as the older ones? I have seen a couple of 2002 - 2006 18 ft. Dauntless for sale at what look like reasonable prices.
Also, why 2 stroke vs. 4 stroke?
__________________
Relax, Stand up and Fly Right